Gay people can't turn straight is what I think….. but depending on the cultural regions, Gay people have to marry one day and live a straight life.

@FairyFae: My mother has my brothers and me! She and her partner have been together for 30+ years. They live in Kansas where gay marriage hasn't been formally legalized yet, but the laws allow for them to be common-law married now. So when my mom had a stroke, her partner, my stepmom, went to a lawyer to find out if she could legally handle Mom's affairs and found out because they had a formal ceremony of committment in front of witnesses (300 of us!) they are married in the eyes of the law. So yes. Family we are! :congrats:

I just think it's funny that Christians (particularly the effervescent body known only as "The Church") keep pretending that they somehow hold a monopoly on the very concept of "marriage", despite the fact that people of all religions (including a lack thereof) and walks of life get married (or whatever their equivalent of "marriage" is) all around the world, with or without their "sanctification". It's why I truly believe that we need to rip the entire concept of "marriage", at least that which religions want to dogmatize, from the legal status of "marriage". Or just completely abolish the paperwork version of marriage altogether, and replace it with a gender- and number-neutral civil union contract setup which gives precisely all of the same rights that current "marriage" does. I've been saying this for a long time, but it needs to happen if we ever hope to get past this issue, because the religious right will keep stirring it up as long as they continue to exist.

@myrea: The question is albeit freewill might exist, in a dogmatic view the path, and choice of path, and circumstance that make you chose said path, is always guided or predestined by a diety in some way… hence (god fault ) this in typical monotheist culture, I'd could easily argue that christianiaty is  not monotheistic and that god is unperfect in the bible, so freewill might actually exist around faulted dieties... Who defines being perfect.. one's idea of perfection is all conditioning.. what may seem perfect to one may not be true for the other.. so if you think that a deity has to be perfect.. it should actually match ones idea of perfection.. hence nothing can be perfect… if viewed by all

@raphjd: Technically, the bible does not condemn gays as beings.  It only condemns gay sex, if interpret it that way. Most modern day believers accept the being vs actions argument. I believe that I pointed that out.  Love the person and not the sin and God did and does.  He prevented the stoning of prostitute because he said "he who is without sin, cast the first stone".  This does not in any way, shape or form mean that he condones Prostitution nor does condone gay sex, even though he still loves gay people and gay people can still follow him.

Regardless of that, it still only shows the magnitude of God's benevolence and not his accpetance of condonation of their behavior.  God also stepped to prevent the stoning of a prostitute, which is also not a condoned behavior.  Again this just shows God's mercy not acceptance.  Love the person and not the sin. :love:

par for the course

@shdwrulr: Also I live in the Bible belt, so it does get into politics and law. All of which is really annoying (especially where people give up science and equality because of their religious views). It is ironic that you mention that they are ignoring science, when few people here are bringing up the science and psychology of homosexuality.  No one else will have an interest if you do not show an interest.

A list of gay churches in your area! http://www.gaychurch.org/list-churches-by-state/ See Leviticus 18:22, Romans 1:27, Deuteronomy 23:18

I identify myself as an agnostic atheist

"Sadly, I'm not too clued in on the eastern religions and their beginnings." Like the rest of the fairy tales they have high points and low points but I don't recommend wasting more than a cursory look.  Given the chance I will kick the 14th Dalai Lama in the groin so hard he will reincarnate as the 15th. Scientology fascinates me in a way, the same way that Nazi Germany does.  I honestly think the only reason they have celebrities members is due to blackmail.  Although I will say researching Scientology introduced me to Jack Parsons and he is one fascinating dude. The Abrahamic religions were what I was referencing when I said "Nothing good ever came from the desert".  I can't wait for the day Xtianinty is exposed for the fraud it is & all those idiots will have to choose between Judaism or Islam to continue worshipping the same God. [image: 81356_1400443369669.jpg]

Hi guys. I have a thought in this matter: @assoom: According to Christianity, Jewish, and Islam, homosexuality is forbidden. Nonetheless, I have met a few strange gay guys who are believers and moreover fundamentalists! How can anybody be gay and a believer at the same time? And the disaster is to be a fundamentalist! I can't say much about Jewish and Islam. I'm a Christian and can say that I see several stages of faith. One of them is what is called "believing", another is "transforming". A christian can believe in the absolute power of God and in all His commandments but not choose to hand over their lives totally to Him. They don't transform into another person. They tend to hand over what hurts them to Him and keep what gives pleasure. Like a baby playing with paper and a pointy scissor, when the father, who knows the danger of that, stands his hands asking for everything he receives only a piece of paper. Common dad, scissors are so much fun!  Well, that's why I think its not so hard to be gay and a believer at the same time. That's why I think I'm still gay and a believer myself. I could be a fundamentalist if I had convinced myself that it would somehow redress my sin. And would feel superior to others as a bonus, after all I was "defending" my God! Probably those guys you met don't know yet that things don't work that way, at least in Christianity. @assoom: Some say God is forgiving!! Well, maybe right (to them) but to logic, God is forgiving when it comes to a sin, two or even 10, not one big unforgivable sin that is part of you and your daily life. Christians learns that the God's only intent toward mankind actually is reestablish the original relationship. By logic, it is impossible if He does not forgives mankind sins. As far as I know, in Christianity, there is only one big unforgivable sin. All other sins are likely to be forgiven by God, homosexuality included, no matter how many times they are committed. Is wonderful to be a Christian, you know that you can jump in God's arms at anytime, they are always open for you. The worst part is when you wanna jump with your pocket full of all kind of "scissors". Those "scissors" you've been carrying for so long that you think is part of you. You know, when you became aware of those "scissors" and pretend they are not a problem and try to make your way to God, you look like that strange guy you met. Anyway, I agree with you, they have to make their mind! At some point I have to make up my own. But scissors are so much fun!  :cool2:

As a person that suffers from depression, I find it odd that people would willingly choose to believe such a sad thing is real - that there is no God. Imagine if that is true, then life itself is meaningless. Meaningless things, like that idiot who drove 80 km/hr on the highway obstructing traffic, MUST PARISH. I hope one day, we come up with the technologies to kill those traffic-obstructing morons who do no respond to honking when driving 80 km/hr on the highway, without leaving traceable evidence. Perhaps some slick tomato sauce on the road, or a nice big 10 Liter metal can of it, through his/her/their wind-shield.

it's a sect

I'm not Muslim and never have been, but I come from a Muslim family. I'm not sure I understand the question, but I'll try: Before praying, you make wudu, which is cleaning certain parts of your body with water. It's supposed to wash off impurities, both physical and spiritual. Five times a day there's salaat, which is a ritualized form of prescribed prayer. There's similar traditions in Catholic or Orthodox Christian ritualized prayers, with motions and prostrations. (I think Catholics these days do kneeling instead of prostrations, and a lot of the Orthodox do a sort of bow-touching-the-floor thing instead of prostrations, but prostrations are native to both traditions). It also has to be made in Arabic, because it is supposed to be the language that God himself spoke to mankind in when he sent down the Qur'an. The heartfelt and personal prayer is dua, where you send up petitions to God in your own language and your own words. Then there is Qur'an recitation, which is akin in spirituality to taking communion in the Christian traditions.

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