Centralized Freeleech Discussions
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i think, his intention was to point out the fact that users were used to make torrents freeleech and download them. in this case there is no accuse against them, since they offered their bonus points in exchange to leeching the torrents. the user wants to say that now, after the change, even if such a user offers his bonus points, he makes the freeleech for others, but he can't download it for himself. good point, i will ask admins if this can get fixed …
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The point is, amice, that the ratio rules shouldn't be overruled by any options - not even with an option, that a user spent his seeding points, to download this torrent. On the other hand, the users should be informed, that it is still nice to make a torrent freeleech, but it will not give them any advantages over the ratio rules.
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but the "over-ruling" was just the intention. it wasn't a "mistake" or sort of that. we just didn't expect that users would abuse the system so widely.
it was meant as a help just for low-ratio users to get some torrents and seed. nobody ordered that only fresh torrents
have tocan be free-leeched, this was a logical mistake of those who made these torrents 'FL'.as for announcements, yes, you are right. but if you can imagine the admins' frustration from users' misbehavior, you can understand the "distant approach".
we will try to make these announcements more visible …
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Most likely will have to adjust the calculation of points needed to make a torrent freeleech in a way that fewer are needed for old torrents and more for new.
It was only posted in this topic that freeleech torrents can be downloaded with download rights suspended (post removed), so was it that it is over at the moment. We now have to observe the statistics if it has the intended effect.
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I started downloading a torrent that was freeleech but I soon discovered that the only seeder had a slow connection.
The remaining freeleech duration was about 2 and a half hours, but according to my BT client, it would take many more hours for the download to complete.
So I went to the torrent's page to spend some SBP so that the freeleech duration can be extended.
But I discovered that I was not given such a choice!
So I had to wait for 2 and a half hours and then make the torrent freeleech again.
It would be nice if we could extend the freeleech duration of a torrent without having to wait for the freeleech status to expire. -
@Dax:
It would be nice if we could extend the freeleech duration of a torrent without having to wait for the freeleech status to expire.
this is a known issue, already on Tom's to-do list. meanwhile you can set your torrent client to stop before the freeleech expires, and continue the next day when you have a time to.
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A change to the Freeleech:
Torrents can only be made Freeleech 48 hours after their shown upload date and time.
This may seen as a disadvantage, but it has as well a positive aspect. 48 hours after upload a torrent is usually very well seed and already a little freeleech duration should be sufficient to download completely. It will avoid as well the points been wasted if the only uploader going offline during the initial seeding on a torrent being made freeleech.
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Just a thought or 2.
Instead of 48 Hours, why not the number of seeders? Some torrents have dozens of seeders only an hour or 2 after upload, where others still seem to lack seeders, possibly due to the genre, maybe day of the week, etc. If a torrent has a set number (10) after only 2 hours, then it is most likely going to be leeched by alot of people and seeded back by many within the 48 hour window, and more likely to see people stop seeding and moving to the next as they think it has plenty of seeders to allow them to stop.
Similar some torrents seem to still lack seeders 4 or 5 days after, yet can be made freeleech when it is clear the chance of getting the torrent down in the free period is impossible.
I appreciate that it has as much to do with connection speeds as seeders, but maybe if a torrent has 10/15/20 seeders it should be open to being made free whether it's 1 hour old or 1 month old.
As for dead and dying torrents what about making them freeleech until they reach a certain number of seeders? By this we are talking torrents that are say 6 months or even a year old, thus getting more people to download them and make them available. If they are in a separate (dead) freeleech section, they won't be hard to find, people can just search through for what they want or what they want to help re-activate. If not "freeleech" then maybe "reducedleech", for example downloading the file only takes 10% of the normal size, this would stop people doing a hit and run, as they would all want to seed back at least the 10% (20% 25%) to cover their ratio.
Maybe it could be possible to give people a bonus for seeding dead/dying torrents to help keep them alive for longer or get them back into use.
People leech what they want to see, and hopefully seed it back. Not many, if any, leech stuff they don't want just to seed it back for the community. Maybe some sort of pick of the torrents/special feature section where say a dozen or so low seeded torrents could be listed, made freeleech/reducedleech, to get people to leech/seed them wether they want them or not would help. Maybe double the seed point bonus per hour till it reaches a set number of seeders
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IIRC from the internal discussion we had, the free-leech script is purely time based and would need modification which the site owner wouldn't want to do it because he doesn't like to mess with the tracker back-end if it's avoidable.
Makes sense, more opportunity for bugs to start popping up, and maybe way too much work trying to fix them.A few of us had similar ideas to yours.
Another issue was that some torrent clients make bad reports to the tracker.
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Well we don't want any bugs or issues now do we, and I can quite understand not wantng to mess with the back end of a tracker :afr:
I still think the 48 hour period is way too much for alot of titles and even detrimental, so an alternative is to reduce it down to say 4 or 5 hours, then put a "CAUTION" statement on the freeleech option warning people that if they use points on low seeded torrents it may be that the freeleech time runs out before they torrent has completed. I'm sure the majority of people have the sense to work out when it is best to make some amount of freeleeech available. Sometimes, just making it free for 3 hours is enough to get people interested so that there are plenty of seeders come the end of the 3 hours. I know i'd rather see say 10 or 20 people with 75% of a torrent down for free, thus seeding that 75% back while they wait for the final 25%, than a torrent with 5 people having 100% and stopping/pausing it cos nobody seems to want it oir doing a hit and run leaving say 2 or 3.
The people who leech within the first 48 hours are usually the ones who have great download and upload internet speeds (and ratios) and can complete the file in only a few hours, yet will continue to seed for quite some time (days, Weeks), so in effect you are actually punsihing some of your best members by making them either wait 48 hours or making them unable to benefit from freeleech. It wouldn't surprise me if it was some of those users actually uploading a new torrent and making it freeleech themselves straight away to increase leechers, thus increasing the number of seeders much quicker.
At the end of the day the seed points belong to the individual user, and as such it should be down to them how they wish to "spend" them, be it for extra ratio / Gifting to a torrent / inviting new users / or using for freeleech. If someone isn't happy and feels that their points are being wasted on freeleech, they simply need not use them for that purpose until they are happy to do so. I doubt anyone would "waste" points giving an invite to someone who they know is going to abuse the site, just as they would not give seedpoints to someone who doesn't complete a torrent or seeds it so slow, that after even 2 weeks they are still the only holder of a full version.
Final note on the dead torrents (again talking 6 months, 1 year, 2 year old) to bring them back, is automatically make them freeleech until such time as they live again. To prevent abuse by people with low ratio's, make them available only to people with a certain ratio like with the DVD and 3D categories. I know you may be thinking, well hold on, surely the people with the high ratios will have seen these ages ago and no longer have them or wish to see them again, and this is exactly why you would make them free, as those users would more likely re-download just to make them available to others than do a hit and run.
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I agree with you about the 48hr period. For me it mostly comes down to letting the users decide how and when they want to spend their points.
We discussed some automation as you described. The thread is kinda long and I don't have time now to read it all again, but there was a problem IIRC.
Your idea for dead torrents won't work because of the way free-leech is implemented, it's for everyone or no one. It can't be for certain user groups or ratio levels. -
May I suggest that uploaders (and Moderators) should have the possibility to make their torrents Freeleach immediately to promote their torrents.
This would be great (and would take into account your arguments).By the way, 48 hours seems quite a long time. I think 18 hours would be a good time.
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May I suggest that uploaders (and Moderators) should have the possibility to make their torrents Freeleach immediately to promote their torrents.
This would be great (and would take into account your arguments).By the way, 48 hours seems quite a long time. I think 18 hours would be a good time.
Agreed, The freeleech system should in some respect manage itself regarding new uploads, as most people uploading and making things instant freeleech, would a) have to have the points to spend in the first place, thus ruling out the majority of (without offense) bad apples, modrators exempt from that reference. b) have the ability to seed at a decent speed, else risk people just deleting the torrent because it would take more than the freeleech time, or have MOD intervention for not seeding thus risking suspension or ban.
I still think that even 18 hours is too long, having seen some torrents reach 20 to 50 seeders in a matter of 4 or 5 hours, which has ment that all those leechers (most of whom will now be the main seeders) have been denied the benefit of freeleech. In a way your almost pushing people towards waiting 48 hours before they even leech in order for them to make torrents freeleech, which will result in the first few hundred torrents just sitting doing nothing for 48 hours and could result in people less likely to upload new torrents as they still have to seed even if nobody is leeching else risk they torrent being delete or them being warned for not seeding a new torrent.
Sadly whatever way you go, someone somewhere isn't gonna be happy, lets hope you can get a nice happy point to please the majority.
As for the deads, I guess it's just down to admin to bring a few back now and then a freeleech and hope they come back to life.
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Wondering why I can't give my own ul freeleech anymore! Anyone who knows why?
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Wondering why I can't give my own ul freeleech anymore! Anyone who knows why?
Maybe this
@Uwe:
A change to the Freeleech:
Torrents can only be made Freeleech 48 hours after their shown upload date and time.
This may seen as a disadvantage, but it has as well a positive aspect. 48 hours after upload a torrent is usually very well seed and already a little freeleech duration should be sufficient to download completely. It will avoid as well the points been wasted if the only uploader going offline during the initial seeding on a torrent being made freeleech.
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I can understand the reasons for a 48 hour delay, but it does seem excessive. I uploaded a 'themed' feature film yesterday and planned to make it freeleech. I didn't realise about the 48 hour change thing until I found this thread. The abillity for the uploader to make a file freeleech right away would be a welcome one. They are unlikely to go to the trouble of uploading a video, spending their own bonus points on making it freeleech, then go offline. I'm guessing here, but I would imagine that it's mostly the uploader of a file that makes it freeleech anyway.
Freeleech is a welcome addition to the site. I occasionally look to see what's on offer and take a chance on a download that I normally wouldn't bother with. I hope the 48 hour rule doesn't reduce the number of these, uploaders could easily forget to go back and make their files freeleech
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I have a question about making torrents freeleech by 'spending' my points: I understand there is a 48-hour delay on new torrents before they can be made freeleech but I'm seeing torrents that are well older (four days or more) than that without the option appearing. Are there other criteria that control this? If so, what are they?
I'd just like to understand how the process works. Thanks!
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One other question…
I noticed that the minimum freeleech period (when it appears) has been changed from 3 hours to 24 hours. I guess the idea is to reduce the 'hit-n-run' effect. Is there some chance of putting in a shorter minimum? Perhaps 12 hours would be a good medium?
Thanks!
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I really liked the freeleech program, and saw lots of advantages in the program including helping your ratio, and in downloading some file that you might never look at without the program.
I no longer see an advantage for the user in the program. It has gone from available instantly, to available 48 hours after posting to what now appears to be a 7 day waiting period after posting (There have been no notices from the board staff about these changes). The minimum number of hours was 3, and now appears to be 24 hours???
As far as using seedbonus…If you save your points to 600, then you can trade for 10GB of credit, or 60 credits for 1GB. Now, with the 24 hour minimum, it appears that you would have to use 200 credits for 1GB, or greater than 3 to 1.
Guess we will have to wait and see what other changes have been or will be made to the program.
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I really liked the freeleech program, and saw lots of advantages in the program including helping your ratio, and in downloading some file that you might never look at without the program.
I completely agree. The freeleech program initially was great to help boost your ratio and now it is practically useless. I was bordering at a 1.00 and having trouble raising it because many of the torrents I would download were already well-seeded and were difficult to break even (1.0 upload & 1.0 download). When the program first started I was able to get my ratio up significantly. Now there is a long waiting period to make a file freeleech and you have to spend an insane amount of bonus points because of the minimum 24-hour period.
I really hope the staff can find a good way to make this work.
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