SJWS - Has anyone met one?
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yeah I've met a few, some are irritating and are too far left politically for my tastes, some are more centrists and fit with my political views
Could you give specific examples? Something on the level of 'did you assume my gender' and 'xe and xer'?
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I'm white and gainfully employed…so I don't have to care about social justice.
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I don't think it's quite that.
The part I was referring to is the bit of C-16 that requires you to call someone by their personally chosen pronouns. Traditionally, personal pronouns are HE, HIM, HIS, SHE, HER, HERS, THEY, THEY'RE, THEIRS. Now it can literally be anything a person can imagine.
Excluding the muslim issue, Canada is only beaten for the SJW award by Sweden.
Oh. Thanks for clearing that up. But still…dammit, human relationships are as complicated as they are without all this nonsense. And somehow they manage to tangle them up more...
This is a textbook example of what I'm trying to talk about. Extreme exaggeration to make this huge, everpresent enemy that doesn't really exist.
http://sds.utoronto.ca/blog/bill-c-16-no-its-not-about-criminalizing-pronoun-misuse/
Did you even read that link?
Just because there isn't a prison sentence assigned to this, it's still got plenty of punative measures in the courts. It's nice how you try to make it appear that I lying about it.
Holy fucking shit, I'M the one in a fucking echo chamber???
You're the one that posts SJW bullshit all day on tis forum so that people can jack off with you on how bad SJWS are.
I'm the one in a fucking echochamber, jesus christ.SJW seem to just be a convenient term to label anyone you don't like. And you are fucking obsessed - just as obsessed as SJWs are.
Your desperation to deny that SJWs are common place shows that you are clearly in an echo chamber. That, or you are being dishonest.
I actually think that you are in an echo chamber and you don't notice SJWs because they fit your confirmation biases. You clearly don't view all the SJW actions over the last decade as anything odd or bad.
LOL, I think you mean like how your side loves to scream "Trump supporter", "racist", "homophobe" and everything else at anyone who disagrees with you.
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I'm not gonna go too deep in what Social Justice means, I'm gonna stick to the category of SJW the OP referred to.
I use Tumblr (and occasionally Reddit) for about 6 years now and I can assume you that things are way worse than you think they are. Just an idea of what kind of arguments exist:
- PERSONAL PRONOUNS: people believe they can CREATE new personal pronouns in a language. Xe/xer, ye/yer, zee/zer, ey/eyr… LITERALLY EVERYONE CREATES THEIR OWN PRONOUNS. Guys, it doesn't work like that. Pronouns are core words and a closed category in a language. You don't just add or remove words that easily. It needs natural evolution of language to happen, and even then only the form of the pronoun may change and not the meaning. Plus, when it comes to gender-neutral pronouns, English is one of the few gender-languages that have gender-neutral pronouns: they/them/their(s). Yes, they are valid pronouns, and they are 100% grammatical and they have been used for ages. If you cannot conform yourself in a specific sex and you feel like using gender-neuter pronouns, stick to the ones that already exist and are canon.
- NEW SEXUALITIES, ROMANTICITIES, AND GENDERS: Iculasexual is not a sexuality. Scoliogender is not a gender. And otherkins (people who believe they are not human but something else, such as an animal, a plant, a mythical creature, a non-living thing, or even an idea) are a joke. And sadly, people on Tumblr and other places will reclaim that belonging to another species is a valid idea, and that includes people who think they are dragons, angels, chairs, or tampons. IF YOU DO ANY OF THOSE PLEASE STOP! You may think you promote equality, etc, but all you do is dehumanize and ridicule the queer spectrum, identity, and philosophy.
- SHAMING MAJORITIES: Tumblr users often try to fight racism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, etc by attacking the majority. That means shaming people for being white, cisgender, heterosexual, male, fully-abled, mentally stable or neurotypical. THEY HAVE TO BE STOPPED.
- RADICAL FEMINISM: Fake "feminism", which is basically dehumanizing male individuals (see: misandry) to counterpart misogyny. Also dehumanizes females who take care of their body, use make-up, work in the sex industry, like sex and are proud of it, are attracted to men only, etc. The problem here is not that radical feminism exists. People can hate whomever they want. Just don't call your hate towards men "feminism" cause it makes real feminism (AKA gender EQUALITY) look bad. Which it's not.
BELIEVING IN ANY OF THOSE THINGS DOESN'T MAKE YOU "COOL" OR "RAD" OR "WOKE". IT MAKES YOU LOOK STUPID. Stop the madness, please.
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I don't think it's quite that.
The part I was referring to is the bit of C-16 that requires you to call someone by their personally chosen pronouns. Traditionally, personal pronouns are HE, HIM, HIS, SHE, HER, HERS, THEY, THEY'RE, THEIRS. Now it can literally be anything a person can imagine.
Excluding the muslim issue, Canada is only beaten for the SJW award by Sweden.
Oh. Thanks for clearing that up. But still…dammit, human relationships are as complicated as they are without all this nonsense. And somehow they manage to tangle them up more...
This is a textbook example of what I'm trying to talk about. Extreme exaggeration to make this huge, everpresent enemy that doesn't really exist.
http://sds.utoronto.ca/blog/bill-c-16-no-its-not-about-criminalizing-pronoun-misuse/
Did you even read that link?
Just because there isn't a prison sentence assigned to this, it's still got plenty of punative measures in the courts. It's nice how you try to make it appear that I lying about it.
Holy fucking shit, I'M the one in a fucking echo chamber???
You're the one that posts SJW bullshit all day on tis forum so that people can jack off with you on how bad SJWS are.
I'm the one in a fucking echochamber, jesus christ.SJW seem to just be a convenient term to label anyone you don't like. And you are fucking obsessed - just as obsessed as SJWs are.
Your desperation to deny that SJWs are common place shows that you are clearly in an echo chamber. That, or you are being dishonest.
I actually think that you are in an echo chamber and you don't notice SJWs because they fit your confirmation biases. You clearly don't view all the SJW actions over the last decade as anything odd or bad.
LOL, I think you mean like how your side loves to scream "Trump supporter", "racist", "homophobe" and everything else at anyone who disagrees with you.
Did you read it? You are over exaggerating to the extreme. No one will ever be jailed for using the wrong pronoun. YOU DON'T HAVE TO CALL PEOPLE BY THEIR PRONOUNS EITHER. THE BILL DOESN'T FUCKING DO THAT.
Let me tell you what kind of chamber I'm in - my college is FULL of people like you that constantly scream the tired 'TRIGGERED' meme all the time and it's the same in most places or with most people here. That's my point, I see people talk about SJWS and complain about them WAY more than I actually see one or interact with one.
I like how you ignored the part where I said that you were in an echo chamber.
And now you're saying things that I've never done because?
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I'm not gonna go too deep in what Social Justice means, I'm gonna stick to the category of SJW the OP referred to.
I use Tumblr (and occasionally Reddit) for about 6 years now and I can assume you that things are way worse than you think they are. Just an idea of what kind of arguments exist:
- PERSONAL PRONOUNS: people believe they can CREATE new personal pronouns in a language. Xe/xer, ye/yer, zee/zer, ey/eyr… LITERALLY EVERYONE CREATES THEIR OWN PRONOUNS. Guys, it doesn't work like that. Pronouns are core words and a closed category in a language. You don't just add or remove words that easily. It needs natural evolution of language to happen, and even then only the form of the pronoun may change and not the meaning. Plus, when it comes to gender-neutral pronouns, English is one of the few gender-languages that have gender-neutral pronouns: they/them/their(s). Yes, they are valid pronouns, and they are 100% grammatical and they have been used for ages. If you cannot conform yourself in a specific sex and you feel like using gender-neuter pronouns, stick to the ones that already exist and are canon.
- NEW SEXUALITIES, ROMANTICITIES, AND GENDERS: Iculasexual is not a sexuality. Scoliogender is not a gender. And otherkins (people who believe they are not human but something else, such as an animal, a plant, a mythical creature, a non-living thing, or even an idea) are a joke. And sadly, people on Tumblr and other places will reclaim that belonging to another species is a valid idea, and that includes people who think they are dragons, angels, chairs, or tampons. IF YOU DO ANY OF THOSE PLEASE STOP! You may think you promote equality, etc, but all you do is dehumanize and ridicule the queer spectrum, identity, and philosophy.
- SHAMING MAJORITIES: Tumblr users often try to fight racism, misogyny, homophobia, transphobia, etc by attacking the majority. That means shaming people for being white, cisgender, heterosexual, male, fully-abled, mentally stable or neurotypical. THEY HAVE TO BE STOPPED.
- RADICAL FEMINISM: Fake "feminism", which is basically dehumanizing male individuals (see: misandry) to counterpart misogyny. Also dehumanizes females who take care of their body, use make-up, work in the sex industry, like sex and are proud of it, are attracted to men only, etc. The problem here is not that radical feminism exists. People can hate whomever they want. Just don't call your hate towards men "feminism" cause it makes real feminism (AKA gender EQUALITY) look bad. Which it's not.
BELIEVING IN ANY OF THOSE THINGS DOESN'T MAKE YOU "COOL" OR "RAD" OR "WOKE". IT MAKES YOU LOOK STUPID. Stop the madness, please.
Could you give any example of this stuff in real life and not tumblr?
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I guess you ignored this bit from your link;
Non-discrimination on the basis of gender identity and expression may very well be interpreted by the courts in the future to include the right to be identified by a person’s self identified pronoun. The Ontario Human Rights Commission, for example, in their Policy on Preventing Discrimination Because of Gender Identity and Expression states that gender harassment should include “ Refusing to refer to a person by their self-identified name and proper personal pronoun”. In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, though the Human Rights Tribunals and courts. And the remedies? Monetary damages, non-financial remedies (for example, ceasing the discriminatory practice or reinstatement to job) and public interest remedies (for example, changing hiring practices or developing non-discriminatory policies and procedures). Jail time is not one of them.
Just because prison isn't one of the punishments, doesn't mean that refusing to use some made up personal pronouns is being criminalized.
Not cleaning up after your dog (dog fouling) is a criminal offense with no jail time. The same with littering. The only difference is the amount of the financial penalty. Many things are criminal offenses, that have no jail time.
You are soooooooooooo desperate to make everyone believe that SJWs don't exist, that you are willing to distort anything that counters your stance.
If you want real world examples of SJWs, then watch YouTube videos. There are countless videos of SJWs doing what they do best. You get to see their logic coming from their own mouths. You get to see how peaceful and lovely they are when someone disagrees with them. You get to see them pour piss on Lauren Southern and try to run away but get caught, because she doesn't agree that there are unliited genders.
You could research all the things I said about feminists/feminism, so you will see that I'm right.
Don't use Tumbler, MTV Decoded, Laci Green and other SJWs to get your info.
Don't listen to Obama and Hillary about SJW "facts". Do the right thing, look at official government stats that proven them wrong or liars.
Don't automatically assume that people who disagree with you are Trump supporters. I hate Trump, just as much as I hate Obama and Hillary.
Don't assume that we're all right wing, because I've only ever voted for 1 republican. Don't assume that people on the right are homophobic. It was the Tory party that gave the UK equal marriage, not Labour or LibDems. The Labour party said they weren't going to revisit Equal marriage because gays civil partnerships. "Separate and somewhat equal" was good enough for the UK's version of the Democrats.
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I don't think it's quite that.
The part I was referring to is the bit of C-16 that requires you to call someone by their personally chosen pronouns. Traditionally, personal pronouns are HE, HIM, HIS, SHE, HER, HERS, THEY, THEY'RE, THEIRS. Now it can literally be anything a person can imagine.
Excluding the muslim issue, Canada is only beaten for the SJW award by Sweden.
Oh. Thanks for clearing that up. But still…dammit, human relationships are as complicated as they are without all this nonsense. And somehow they manage to tangle them up more...
This is a textbook example of what I'm trying to talk about. Extreme exaggeration to make this huge, everpresent enemy that doesn't really exist.
http://sds.utoronto.ca/blog/bill-c-16-no-its-not-about-criminalizing-pronoun-misuse/
I just noticed that you used an article by a Professor of Gender Diversity Studies. Can we say "biased"?! You really should watch the debates on C-16. You can find the videos on YouTube.
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"SJW" is just the new cool fearmongering term that conservatives and some centrists like to use, just like the "uppities" and the Great Feminist Menace
of yesteryear (even though some people today still seem to be stuck in the past, tragically).The reality is that save for a few misguided folks, usually teens who don't have a very in-depth grasp of social politics, as well as a good lot of blatant trolls who know very well what they're doing, the majority of what gets classified as "some kind of SJW bullshit" can be anything from centrist/mainstream/"normal" equality politics (the kind your local law already accounts for, probably, unless you live in some fundie haven), to politics further on the left that favour equity over equality, to radical left politics which don't beat around the bush when it comes to identifying and bringing attention to inequality and "heavier" forms of oppression (like fascism or imperialism), and which are generally known for not being very nice, as they forego all forms of respectability politics.
It's a lot easier to just call everything you don't like or wish to comprehend "SJW bullshit" and label everyone who tries to have a rational discussion about these politics a "pesky SJW" or a "tumblrina" even if they aren't as per the words' definitions, which is why threads like these end up being created everywhere on the Internet, including gay porn sites apparently.
EDIT: Also, according to a lot of people, even something as simple as bringing up LGBT topics or just mentioning that gay people exist is considered "SJW bullshit" and "pandering", which should give you an idea of just how useful that term is in general.
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Could you give any example of this stuff in real life and not tumblr?
Oh honey, trust me, everyone has met radical misandrists (self-proclaimed feminists) in real life. I'm part of the Anarcha-queer community in my country and I have seen a lot of women shaming men just because they are men. As well as shaming other women just because they consider themselves 100% heterosexual and like going with men. This year I even encountered someone who claimed that men should not take off their t-shirts cause it's making women uncomfortable. But it doesn't end there, women should also not take their top off, if they fall into the stereotypical "beauty" category cause it's making other women uncomfortable too. This is not what Feminism is about. Feminism is about freedom and equality: if a guy (or a girl or anyone) takes their shirt off as a sign of personal freedom, you don't shame them and tell them to put it on again. You take your shirt off too. Screaming onto other people's ideas of freedom won't help anyone. You are just being a jerk if you do so.
As for majority shaming: Sadly, there DO exist people who blatantly believe that belonging in a majority is a felony. Yes, in real life. From racial minorities who attack whites in Western cultures, LGBT people who attack straight people (i.e straight allies, who apparently are only show offs since they want to be seen as LGBT rights supporters but are not LGBT themselves), women shaming men (radical feminism, see above), atheists shaming believers of any religion (I'm an atheist myself but I wouldn't try to hide that people do that a lot for years and years now; no matter how bad it makes me feel about being an atheist, it's true and we have to admit it)
I cannot specifically give you examples from real life about people who use self-made pronouns, since most of those cases are in the English-speaking world (primarily the US) and I live in a non-English-speaking country (aka my language is different). But I do know that those people and those pronouns exist, I'm a Linguistics major and this subject has been discussed a lot in my classes (my American professors also gave us examples of those in real life).
For new sexuality terms: people already started using words such as "demi-sexual" here. It's happening slowly and luckily it's not a big thing yet but it will go there, sadly.
All I know is that this is all because of the internet. Cause yes, it gives us freedom of speech and expression, anyone can say whatever they want, but it also makes people passive, not researching anything they read or hear. Just don't believe and follow ideas blindly. Follow your own ideology, and let it mature over time, it will find it's way.
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Not yet more drivel on a subject none of you will agree on :th:
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"SJW" is just the new cool fearmongering term that conservatives and some centrists like to use, just like the "uppities" and the Great Feminist Menace
of yesteryear (even though some people today still seem to be stuck in the past, tragically).The reality is that save for a few misguided folks, usually teens who don't have a very in-depth grasp of social politics, as well as a good lot of blatant trolls who know very well what they're doing, the majority of what gets classified as "some kind of SJW bullshit" can be anything from centrist/mainstream/"normal" equality politics (the kind your local law already accounts for, probably, unless you live in some fundie haven), to politics further on the left that favour equity over equality, to radical left politics which don't beat around the bush when it comes to identifying and bringing attention to inequality and "heavier" forms of oppression (like fascism or imperialism), and which are generally known for not being very nice, as they forego all forms of respectability politics.
It's a lot easier to just call everything you don't like or wish to comprehend "SJW bullshit" and label everyone who tries to have a rational discussion about these politics a "pesky SJW" or a "tumblrina" even if they aren't as per the words' definitions, which is why threads like these end up being created everywhere on the Internet, including gay porn sites apparently.
EDIT: Also, according to a lot of people, even something as simple as bringing up LGBT topics or just mentioning that gay people exist is considered "SJW bullshit" and "pandering", which should give you an idea of just how useful that term is in general.
I guess you mean like the left calling everyone a racist, sexist, homophobe, etc, etc, etc who disagrees with them.
I'm an egalitarian and I'm called a woman hater because I believe in true gender equality. I guess my sisters, mom and female family and friends are also wome haters. They too hate feminism, for the reasons I have outlined in various threads.
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Not yet more drivel on a subject none of you will agree on :th:
If you don't like the topic, then don't read it. How simple is that?
And no need to double post (other post removed as spam) your whining.
Besides, it makes you hypocritical considering your constant fights with Ellis.
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I guess you ignored this bit from your link;
Non-discrimination on the basis of gender identity and expression may very well be interpreted by the courts in the future to include the right to be identified by a person’s self identified pronoun. The Ontario Human Rights Commission, for example, in their Policy on Preventing Discrimination Because of Gender Identity and Expression states that gender harassment should include “ Refusing to refer to a person by their self-identified name and proper personal pronoun”. In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, though the Human Rights Tribunals and courts. And the remedies? Monetary damages, non-financial remedies (for example, ceasing the discriminatory practice or reinstatement to job) and public interest remedies (for example, changing hiring practices or developing non-discriminatory policies and procedures). Jail time is not one of them.
Just because prison isn't one of the punishments, doesn't mean that refusing to use some made up personal pronouns is being criminalized.
Not cleaning up after your dog (dog fouling) is a criminal offense with no jail time. The same with littering. The only difference is the amount of the financial penalty. Many things are criminal offenses, that have no jail time.
You are soooooooooooo desperate to make everyone believe that SJWs don't exist, that you are willing to distort anything that counters your stance.
I like how you conveniently left this out:
"So what does this mean for pronoun misuse? Well, refusing to use a person’s self identified pronoun is not going to be considered advocating genocide – unless the refusal to use the pronouns was accompanied by actually advocating genocide against trans and gender non-binary folks.Similarly, it’s hard to see the refusal to use the appropriate pronoun –without something else – rising to the threshold of hate speech. Hate speech laws in Canada have only been used- and only can be used – against extreme forms of speech – explicitly and extreme forms of homophobic, anti-Semitic or racist speech. Moreover, prosecution needs the approval of the Attorney General."
If you want real world examples of SJWs, then watch YouTube videos. There are countless videos of SJWs doing what they do best. You get to see their logic coming from their own mouths. You get to see how peaceful and lovely they are when someone disagrees with them. You get to see them pour piss on Lauren Southern and try to run away but get caught, because she doesn't agree that there are unliited genders.
THIS IS MY FUCKING POINT! The only place I see SJWS are on the internet. What are you not getting? Why are so threatened by this idea? In none of my comments did I say SJWs didn't exist yet you keep saying that I want them to not exist.
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Do you lot ever get bored? Because I do.
Pointless verbose exchanges between people who will never agree aren't the most edifying topic on a gay torrent site.
And you do go on and on and on and on….
I'm trying to get an opposing viewpoint in here. This place is an echo chamber.
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Could you give any example of this stuff in real life and not tumblr?
Oh honey, trust me, everyone has met radical misandrists (self-proclaimed feminists) in real life. I'm part of the Anarcha-queer community in my country and I have seen a lot of women shaming men just because they are men. As well as shaming other women just because they consider themselves 100% heterosexual and like going with men. This year I even encountered someone who claimed that men should not take off their t-shirts cause it's making women uncomfortable. But it doesn't end there, women should also not take their top off, if they fall into the stereotypical "beauty" category cause it's making other women uncomfortable too. This is not what Feminism is about. Feminism is about freedom and equality: if a guy (or a girl or anyone) takes their shirt off as a sign of personal freedom, you don't shame them and tell them to put it on again. You take your shirt off too. Screaming onto other people's ideas of freedom won't help anyone. You are just being a jerk if you do so.
That's strange, I wasn't there a huge feminist free the nipple movement early this year?
Do you think that person you met represents all feminists? -
I guess you ignored this bit from your link;
Non-discrimination on the basis of gender identity and expression may very well be interpreted by the courts in the future to include the right to be identified by a person’s self identified pronoun. The Ontario Human Rights Commission, for example, in their Policy on Preventing Discrimination Because of Gender Identity and Expression states that gender harassment should include “ Refusing to refer to a person by their self-identified name and proper personal pronoun”. In other words, pronoun misuse may become actionable, though the Human Rights Tribunals and courts. And the remedies? Monetary damages, non-financial remedies (for example, ceasing the discriminatory practice or reinstatement to job) and public interest remedies (for example, changing hiring practices or developing non-discriminatory policies and procedures). Jail time is not one of them.
Just because prison isn't one of the punishments, doesn't mean that refusing to use some made up personal pronouns is being criminalized.
Not cleaning up after your dog (dog fouling) is a criminal offense with no jail time. The same with littering. The only difference is the amount of the financial penalty. Many things are criminal offenses, that have no jail time.
You are soooooooooooo desperate to make everyone believe that SJWs don't exist, that you are willing to distort anything that counters your stance.
I like how you conveniently left this out:
"So what does this mean for pronoun misuse? Well, refusing to use a person’s self identified pronoun is not going to be considered advocating genocide – unless the refusal to use the pronouns was accompanied by actually advocating genocide against trans and gender non-binary folks.Similarly, it’s hard to see the refusal to use the appropriate pronoun –without something else – rising to the threshold of hate speech. Hate speech laws in Canada have only been used- and only can be used – against extreme forms of speech – explicitly and extreme forms of homophobic, anti-Semitic or racist speech. Moreover, prosecution needs the approval of the Attorney General."
If you want real world examples of SJWs, then watch YouTube videos. There are countless videos of SJWs doing what they do best. You get to see their logic coming from their own mouths. You get to see how peaceful and lovely they are when someone disagrees with them. You get to see them pour piss on Lauren Southern and try to run away but get caught, because she doesn't agree that there are unliited genders.
THIS IS MY FUCKING POINT! The only place I see SJWS are on the internet. What are you not getting? Why are so threatened by this idea? In none of my comments did I say SJWs didn't exist yet you keep saying that I want them to not exist.
Seriously, are you really that desperate that you are ignoring the bit I quoted from your link? Nothing in the bit says you need genocide to be guilty of a hate crime.
You want people to think SJWs don't exist because you never met one in real life. If you limit your "news" to Tumblr, Salon, MTV Decoded and whatnot, they won't show the stories about SJWs going mental. Try broadening your news sources and you will see a lot more SJWs.
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Vocal Minority? To be honest, the only time I EVER hear about SJWs is when other people on the internet complain about them.
Here's the bit where you claim SJWs only ever exist is in minds of "other people" (read: people who disagree with you) on the internet.
Also, GT.ru is not an echo chamber because we don't censor view points, despite how many SJWs report topics insisting they be deleted. Everyone can express their viewpoint, unless they start name calling, which over the last few days I have, as the forum admin, ignored when people have called me a troll and other things.
The only thing topics we do not allow are illegal ones, as noted in the forum rules.
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Vocal Minority? To be honest, the only time I EVER hear about SJWs is when other people on the internet complain about them.
Here's the bit where you claim SJWs only ever exist is in minds of "other people" (read: people who disagree with you) on the internet.
Also, GT.ru is not an echo chamber because we don't censor view points, despite how many SJWs report topics insisting they be deleted. Everyone can express their viewpoint, unless they start name calling, which over the last few days I have, as the forum admin, ignored when people have called me a troll and other things.
The only thing topics we do not allow are illegal ones, as noted in the forum rules.
I did not say those words. What the fuck? I said the only time a hear about SJWs is when people on the internet complain about them. I didn't say they didn't exist. I don't know why you keep saying that I'm saying that but I'm not. You're arguing against a strawman.
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Umm, that quote is exactly what you said.
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